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Multi Level Marketing (Herbalife)

I have been inside of a MLM for years observing the influence on population. It's teachings also spreads the idea of creating your own reality and promotes freedom. Financial to be exact. Consciousness is a part of that. Most people are not aware of that how they can create money. Some people say it hurts people in general with illegal pyramid scheme similarities. My truth and opinion: Only a few people succssede in this kind of bussiness, but it's also like that in classic enterpreneural world. The difference is that information that they give you is not for anybody to listen. Some people get hurt by beliveing they can achieve sth, cuz their expectations and goals doesn't mach their action. But MLM does that to people cuz of an influence of successful people that do the educations. The problem is anybody can join and think thay are the one who will succeede. That leads to the question are they victims for loosing their money and time? Is it a victim blaming system and narcissistic tribe? Or is it members fault, because on education there are disclaimers and sayings it's just a possibility and opportunity, but not a promise? 

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MLM is  driven by the profit. It's success depends on how in need of its products people are. Therefore they are not genuinely interested in people's long-term well being . 

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I listened to a pitch from one multi-level marketing company.  This pitch was the only advertisement allowed by the company.  The pitch was completely directed towards recruiting more sales staff and not really directed to selling their products.

So... if you are one of their marketers/salespeople, the only advertisements allowed do not really make people want to buy the products then what you have, in my opinion, is a pyramid scheme dressed up as MLM.

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6 hours ago, Garnet said:

MLM is  driven by the profit. It's success depends on how in need of its products people are. Therefore they are not genuinely interested in people's long-term well being . 

So is the rest of the world and all of the society. Your oppinion on differences? Every product and service on earth is made out of solving a problem and result of people buying it is profit.

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1 hour ago, Scot said:

I listened to a pitch from one multi-level marketing company.  This pitch was the only advertisement allowed by the company.  The pitch was completely directed towards recruiting more sales staff and not really directed to selling their products.

So... if you are one of their marketers/salespeople, the only advertisements allowed do not really make people want to buy the products then what you have, in my opinion, is a pyramid scheme dressed up as MLM.

Here is not like that, but it still feels off to me sometimes. My experience with it is good, but someone close to me is really struggling, and I think that effects me. 

Edited by Hechi

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The goal of any business is to make money.  That is it.  Now if you have an immediate reaction that "just making money" is evil, I would like you look a little deeper.  

Maybe a company wants to put out a quality product.  But of course they want and deserve to make money doing it.  I say that there is nothing wrong with that.

On the other hand, if a company puts out a crappy or even dangerous product, pulls the wool over people's eyes to convince them that it's good then that company is pretty evil.

Problem is there is a big grey area in the middle.  A product sometimes needs to be "good enough".  If you totally overbuild your product and someone else produces a product that is good enough and cheaper then guess what, the overbuilt product isn't going to sell.

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25 minutes ago, Scot said:

The goal of any business is to make money.  That is it.  Now if you have an immediate reaction that "just making money" is evil, I would like you look a little deeper.  

Maybe a company wants to put out a quality product.  But of course they want and deserve to make money doing it.  I say that there is nothing wrong with that.

On the other hand, if a company puts out a crappy or even dangerous product, pulls the wool over people's eyes to convince them that it's good then that company is pretty evil.

Problem is there is a big grey area in the middle.  A product sometimes needs to be "good enough".  If you totally overbuild your product and someone else produces a product that is good enough and cheaper then guess what, the overbuilt product isn't going to sell.

There is nothing wrong with the product in this case. And system is great for many reasons, but I think that the world is not ready for that. What conceres me is the effect it has on peoples minds. And when someone joins, it's hard to stop, even if it creates you souffering, like in unhelathy relationships. System reinforces great deal of intermittent reinforcement and cognitive dissonance in people. I am starting to think it is great for mentally strong people, but the reality is that weak one's join for to become stronger and on the road, too many of them suffer inside and can't tell anybody what is borhering them because they think they harm others by "complaining". 

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I wanted to share my experience and perspective:

The company functiones as MLM (multi level marketing). I love their products and been using it for 6 years, since when my ex is in the company as independent distributor. I lost over 20 kilos (44.0925) and decided to help other people about that. So I was attending their events and educational system. When you look at it that was it's a great business opportunity, but on the inside there are many people who earn a little money or nothing, 
and a few of them are getting really rich, living a lavish lifestyles and being a role model for everyone else. It's like that also in the classic system and there is 
nothing wrong about that. But all of that avarage people belive they can reach that goal also motivated by role models.

So... my ex also dreames about that success, but all that he has done in 6 years is lost so much money and been using my and his family to invest huge amounts of money in his business.

The system functiones like big narcissistic tribe and distributors are tought that their are the only ones who's happiness depends on them. That is true and I belive that also, but what it all comes down to is that if you don't succsede you get to blame only yourself (blaming the victim). And it isolates step by step their members from people that are not involved in the company, because they are threat to success. But not completely, because they need that people for references and to join also to do the same.

If you loose money for not working the right way or working too much, you stay there because of your belives, intermittend reinforcement effect and cognitive dissonance effect.

 It's ideal place for narcissistic behaviour.
All you have to do to make money is look great, be fancyer as possible and show off, fake it until you make it philosophy. 

My ex financially destroyed our family and our marrige, despite of me supporting him all along and wanting him to succeed not to destroy his dreams. 

He is naturally kind of a narcissistic person, but system multipled that 100 times in him. He is living in lala land too much.

There are positive side of everyting, normally, but colectivelly it's harmful i think.

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4 hours ago, Hechi said:

So is the rest of the world and all of the society. Your oppinion on differences? Every product and service on earth is made out of solving a problem and result of people buying it is profit.

I think it depends on a customer and how they make a decision . 

Let's look at one of the most basic things we do on a daily basis - shopping.

As a former retailer I had to experience and observe  the smart strategy /work that went behind the curtain of the stores I worked for.

It really all about the available choices in a current moment . The more choices we have the longer it takes for us to make a decision .  And most of the time the best decision is usually within 1-5 picks... depending how it goes... Has anyone noticed that?

Also the more choices we have the more chances are we actually end up making the wrong decision . And you may not even realize it but you'd probably  have that seed of doubt about your choice . 

Unsatisfaction with the purchase leads to another purchase to make yourself feel better and so on.

As a customer (tool for the pyramid ) we are looking for a sign that we are making the right decision . That's why there's often a reward at the end of a purchase in a form of a discount or a free sample to assure you about your choice . Or to help you out with the purchase. Depends how you look at it.

So this made me think how drastically retail industry would have to change if customers started choosing products solely by feel . 

There is category of shopping that gets a lot of negative talk - impulse purchases  . Let's admit we all have done it. Sometimes it was worth while ,  sometimes it is not at all. But to me there has been always something about it. The "reward " of an impulse purchase - you either hate it later or absolutely love it. And this is the key.

So in this way the impulse purchase communicates back to you very clearly  about itself . 

Here's an example of a game I like to play where I basically go "blind" or not much thinking involved... and let my hand pick an item. Funny, this blind shopping gets better the more I practice...

 

20170917_124933.jpg

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That's interesting how our brains work. But I don't see a point how with that you corelate/or not, regular marketing and sales with mlm. When I do my business, I am trying to be direct as much as possible with people and comunicate with them is my help and product sth they really need and not to do sth impulsive. I wish all of the sales people in mlm are like that, it would be a different system and more positive opinions on mlm in general

Edited by Hechi

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@Hechi i can't say that this is how the brain works... although  the marketing system was built a certain way around it years ago and it did work. Hasn't changed much. And as far as i know they are trying to go deeper and manipulate buying response through different addictives including through memory/feeling stimulation. We can see now that the typical sales system  is failing . How often do you hear: oh, gosh... what are they trying to sell me again. And it's funny to me that they still teach the same approaches !

8 hours ago, Hechi said:

What conceres me is the effect it has on peoples minds. And when someone joins, it's hard to stop,

I don't know why you say that. I've been with Oriflame in the past and had no problems with quitting.  But I also knew people who took Herbalife to the extreme. 

One thing I am 100% sure about is that deliberate (or when being too direct) selling hasn't really working worked for me. My sales has always revolved around me. Not me around my sales. I don't know how else to put this. 

I think the best way to sell your product is by letting people try it first.  The the same way when you go to the farmers market and some of the farmers let you try their produce. Those who like it will buy it (if they can afford it, of course ) and eventually  tell their friends and family. This is how you can build your long -term customer base since people are creatures of habbits )))))

 

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10 hours ago, Garnet said:

@Hechi i can't say that this is how the brain works... although  the marketing system was built a certain way around it years ago and it did work. Hasn't changed much. And as far as i know they are trying to go deeper and manipulate buying response through different addictives including through memory/feeling stimulation. We can see now that the typical sales system  is failing . How often do you hear: oh, gosh... what are they trying to sell me again. And it's funny to me that they still teach the same approaches !

I don't know why you say that. I've been with Oriflame in the past and had no problems with quitting.  But I also knew people who took Herbalife to the extreme. 

One thing I am 100% sure about is that deliberate (or when being too direct) selling hasn't really working worked for me. My sales has always revolved around me. Not me around my sales. I don't know how else to put this. 

I think the best way to sell your product is by letting people try it first.  The the same way when you go to the farmers market and some of the farmers let you try their produce. Those who like it will buy it (if they can afford it, of course ) and eventually  tell their friends and family. This is how you can build your long -term customer base since people are creatures of habbits )))))

 

I know how to get my customers, I really want them to have results, and to change their way of eating and taking care of themselves for the rest of their lives and to pass good habits to their children. Whatever I do, I do it for the purpose of people feeling better and let money be just an outcome of my service and relationship that I build with them. When I said direct, I meant clearing their dessision, after they try it. Because some of them trick themselves into buying, and I don't want that. I think it's a little bit differnet with Hlf than Oriflame. It's a way of living. And it penetrates you deep in the core. I'm sure I will use the products for the rest of my life, weather I do business with it or not. And I think it's like that with the business too for people who did it for years, even if it was a dissaster, because they have to justify to themselves and people around that it was worth it. It makes sense with the products (cuz they work for everybody), but not with business (that isn't always a best thing to do for everyone). Read my/my ex's story above if you didn't. I have a feeling that a lot of distributors go through simmilar circumstances psihologyicay from the inside and out. I think many entrepreneurs go trough simmilar stuff, and when it gets hard they have to remember why they even started, but here the system keeps you very hooked. It's great when someone uses that in their advantage, but a lot of people don't know how to do that and still keep themselves hooked.

Edited by Hechi

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@Hechi i re-read your reply.

Tbh I've never made tons of money with Oriflame or when working in retail but it did provide me with what I needed at that time. Besides ,  sales people are not paid high in a current system so unless you love what you do you 'll enjoy it.... otherwise I would never suggest anyone to go into it!

Also MLM is good as a side job imo. Like you said you use and love the product yourself and if you're around people who are also interested.... I guess, why not to sell, right? Actually the lack of resourcefulness was the reason why I quit Oriflame . Plus I wasn't an expert in the field of cosmetics and skin care. I was 16. Perhaps if I took it with me when i went to college things would have been different. Who knows. 

The other problem I had was shipping. It was relatively new business back then and shipment was taken forever like 3-4 weeks. And if they made a mistake in the order that was a disaster . 

I am sure it's all different now. Google, YouTube and other social media alone can increase any sales drastically . 

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